Judd,

You are right and awesome.

The trouble for me, Judd, is that I feel like I've still got a lot to learn myself. I read some of these threads and I just know that somebody is going to come along and dissect the issue better than me. Most of my time I don't think my thoughts are worth the bandwidth.

I'll see what I can do, chief.

Also, droog, I feel like it's almost better, in discussion-and-learning terms, to ask questions and be uncertain and exploratory, than to make pronouncements and give advice. That's how I learned what little design I know; by hanging out with people that asked questions with me.

Shreyas,

Rock on.

A few well placed questions are worth dozens of pronouncements from the mount.

Forum communication is all about the back and forth and getting a new and tentative game designer to answer questions and think about their game is so damned important.

Awesome, Jonathan.

Be a Cooperator Week doesn't have the same ring as Be a Mentor does.

Nathan speaks his Hamster Truth from his Running Wheel of Wisdom.

What's up with the hamster thing, anyway?

You can tell that the hamster is a hamster prophet because he speaks from within a burning scamper-wheel.

This is so right on. Just having somebody drop in and ask a question or say "I like this part" made so much difference for me, too. I am resolved to do better by folks too.

Plus, it is the good stuff to see what people are coming up with. Just so little time lately to do anything but finish game! Next year, better time management: the better to be more available, and the better to not be a lunatic leading up to GenCon. : )

Hi All,
I mentored Judd through the production process of Dictionary of Mu. (Ron shepherded him through the early idea and writing phases.) Every year I try to pick a project that has nothing to do with my own stuff and help out. Sometimes it gets finished/produced -- Mu, NPA -- sometimes it doesn't.

Obviously, the mentoring process can take on many forms. For Judd, I was something like a creative director and publisher (and publishing mentor). The first step for me was reading the Mu manuscript. The book struck a deep chord with me and I called Judd right away and told him I either wanted to publish it myself or help him publish it. And I wanted a shot at doing the layout.

He thought about it for close to year, I think. When he decided he was interested in going forward, I told him to get a finished draft together.

Once he had a rough manuscript, I talked to him about production schedules -- how to go from editing, to art, to layout and then to the printer. We set a rough schedule and then I helped him get in contact with the editors and the artists. No big deal, right? I agree. I think my biggest contribution to the whole project was simply keeping in touch with Judd and asking, "How's it going?" Sometimes I'd prod him about deadlines, but usually it was just a "tell me what's going on with Mu." And when ever he hit a stumbling block, I was available to answer questions. Mu has a fantastic attention to detail in it, I'd like to think that by helping Judd through some of the publishing hurdles and being moral support, I freed him to evoke the awesome feel of the book.

So, to all the self-published game author designers out there: Pick a fledgling project and share your knowledge. This is not merely one session of advice. In this process you commit yourself to seeing the project completed -- the mentor has to be as committed as the author. Despite the DIY attitude in our circles, it's likely that someone who has been through the process already has a good deal of knowledge and experience to share.

The publishing process is arduous and taxing. Having someone along for the ride to offer insight or encouraging words can be valuable. It can also increase the quality of the games we release and knit the community together more tightly.

-L

Posted By: Judd I'm just saying that there is a cycle here and we need to be very conscious of giving back.

The interweb comunity is all about the Karma. Be a mentor week is an awesome idea.

I know I'm terrible at lurking, thinking "oh, I can reply to that" and then never getting round to it.

I accept hugs as a perfectly viable form of currency.

I hate* the concept of "Be a Mentor week", I agree with Luke, it should be "Be a Mentor".

Also, I discussed the very same issue with some people before, another thing that adds is the cycle, even of newcomers: Come to Forge, design game(with relatively little input, and the input that's given usually has little experience behind it), retreat to cave and design game, leaving even more recent newcomers, once again, alone.

Also, I think more attention to the Playtest forum and to playtest calls is in order. Writing a game is not as hard as to keep on working on it in the face of no feedback.

* Not really.

Posting on the First Thoughts forum is just a little step and my hope is that it will become a habit. A friendly post is only a sliver of a sliver of what Ron and Luke did with me and Mu.

But I figured it'd be a way to harness all of this pre-Gen Con posting energy in a good way.

Yes, baby steps, and then a sprint ;)

All baby steps are good, hopefully playtests will also get some work. Which I'm also guilty of.

Heh.

I know what you mean, and I think you know what I mean.

Aren't we great? :P

Figures :P

I agree entirely; it's hella hard.

But it's easier and better than telling people stuff, in my opinion. (On the other hand, posting something that's 'just okay' is better than sitting on your hands trying to think of a post that's 'good.')

Meg, I'm really glad you perservered, but next time, post your own AP posts. That was like, the least feedback-likely kind of AP post there is.

1. Established "name" posts it - it's Vincent's name on it, not yours, so some readers are going to be loath to tell the Grand Master what they think of his wife's baby game
2. It's mostly a rave about how cool the game is, without any questions or places it seems to be soliciting input
3. Nobody but a few people have seen the game text yet
4. It's long and filled with fiction-details instead of real-people and real-mechanics details

Of course, I should talk. I find writing good, open, comment-inviting AP hard as hell.

Ben - well, you're in the credits for it, so yes, it was at least 'semi-useful' :)

Here's the thing: I like giving feedback. I'm pretty decent at it. If I read your stuff, look at your cover art, or try your mechanics, I'm going to let you know. If you have a heading that says in any way "Hey, feedback would be cool!" I'm there, kids and life permiting. The style that Luke talks about above is very similar to mine. I've actually sent more PMs to Forge folk saying 'Hey, that AP sounds awesome!' because while I'm not saying anything thread-worthy, knowing someone out there saw your work and gave a damn long enough to say so rocks.

Mark: The last three points, ok, and your very last point, heck yeah.

Well, as part of our run-up to GenCon, the various UK designers in attendance are sharing demos, testing for each other and so forth. Last week, Iain ran through his 15 minute demo of Mob Justice, got feedback, ran it again and made changes. Gregor ran through his demo fo Best Friends as well, and again feedback was given. This week I'm going to be testing Cold City and we'll also be taking a look at Joes 'Contenders' and Matts 'Covenant' in order to make sure we can run each others games. And we (as in Gregor, Iain and myself) will be having a go at running each others demos as well. So, maybe this isn't mentoring in the broader sense, but it looks to be a valuable and productive experience.

Cheers
Malc

So people, how did you do?