Marvel Launch Parties + Cheat Sheets!

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  • Yes!

    Also one size doesn't fit all, which is why I've been designing elements in Microsoft Word so almost anyone can change them for their specific group. I love indesign and use it professionally but I'm taking a hit for the team. ::cries:: And damn... it hurts!
  • edited March 2012
    This is a fantastic review from one of the GMs at our Saturday event:
    http://muleabides.wordpress.com/2012/03/05/marvel-heroic-musing-hesitantly/

    James is well spoke, intelligent, and well worth listening to.

    Parts of the review may sound negative, may even be negative but it is raw and truthful (and there is plenty of positive). Some reviews tend to be the bad kind of marketing, press releases in the guise of reviews or they tend to be uninformed reviews, opinion without actual play. There is none of that here. It makes it clear who may not or may like the game and why. The review is based on actual play with a wide assortment of people.

    But to be fair (and to add context), many of the players involved were hardcore Marvel FASERIP, Champions, Mutants & Masterminds, and OSR enthusiasts. But most are also die hard comic book fans. The review also starts off with talk about Iron Man pretending to be drunk and Colossus being wasted. Clearly this is going to influence the rest of the game (although again to be fair, given Iron Man's Milestones, we heard of several games that included these type of scenes). But this was only 1 out of 3 games James ran that day. The other games didn't have this kind of content. Also to be fair, these are 1 shots and some of these games are with strangers. And some of the problems pointed out (confusing terminology) are also problems James and crew feel other superhero RPGs also have. That all said, I think James has some very useful insights.

    It's also worth reading some of the comments below the review. Especially from Jon Hastings and Barking Alien.

    Full disclosure: James is also a friend so I'm biased when recommending his review.
  • I have added some colour to the sheets. They are still pretty ugly but hopefully the mad colour will help add layers to the sheet. The links above still work plus I also added a Shadowcat PC Sheet.
  • edited March 2012
    "Parts of the review may sound negative, may even be negative but it is raw and truthful (and there is plenty of positive)"
    Marvel Heroic reminds me of 4e in many ways, but mostly in the courageous design decision to not please everyone. I may end up being one of the displeased people, but I intend to play this game a lot: it does many things better than Marvel Super Heroes (my old stand-by), and it's complex enough that you can't make up your mind based on just a few sessions.
    The review also starts off with talk about Iron Man pretending to be drunk and Colossus being wasted. Clearly this is going to influence the rest of the game (although again to be fair, given Iron Man's Milestones, we heard of several games that included these type of scenes).
    That was Tavis and his son! Tavis apparently found this part to be hugely immersive and interesting, and I don't think was out of character for Downey-era Iron Man or for Colossus who gets rewarded for playing up his Russian cliches (which apparently including dancing a vodka-fueled jig).
  • I slapped up an illustrated example of play based on arguments this weekend about the rules.
  • I would like to add a big thanks to jenskot for hosting this awesome game. I heard about it randomly from my brother (I am in the first picture involving people... Human Torch) and since I love Marvel decided to check it out.

    -> I enjoyed the dice pool building (reminded me of Dogs)
    -> I liked that the damage took advantage of the size of the die rather than the number rolled
    -> The Doom Pool added a nice countdown feature. I would love to play in a game where the Doom Pool reached near max.

    Overall, I'm excited for the release of this game.
  • I'm pitching a mega Marvel Heroic event for ConnectiCon.

    ConCon attracts over 7,000 cosplayers.

    I can imagine an event that's like Games on Demand, always running, drop in and out as you like, where you play a Marvel character based on your costume!

    Maybe we can have a Shield Staging Area that acts as a lobby for socializing where a GM can help attendees create characters based on their costumes. When you are done, you are loaded into the game. We'll have a score board for unlocking different achievements and give out prizes at the end of each day.

    Many possibilities!
  • Character creation can be done in character as part of a job interview. To make it fast, we can print all the different powers on stickers and labels so we can paste the different options on a blank character sheet based on the interviewees' answers. No writing. Just peel, stick, done.

    If we do this, I'll probably need to somehow pull together resources to do this correctly, including prize support. Maybe the con will help. Too soon for those details.
  • I would totes come in a black suit if you gave me a SHIELD ID and said I would stage cosplay characters into a Marvel RPG demo. I would say that SHIELD does not have a sense of humor that it is aware of at this time. Maybe at Tucson ComiCon? Hmmm.
  • Posted By: JDCorleyI would totes come in a black suit if you gave me a SHIELD ID and said I would stage cosplay characters into a Marvel RPG demo. I would say that SHIELD does not have a sense of humor that it is aware of at this time. Maybe at Tucson ComiCon? Hmmm.
    Yes!

    I'd be happy to compare notes and brainstorm. I would love it if you did this at Tucson ComiCon.

    I remember one time you talked about PTA where the Producer was actually a... TV Producer! That seemed pretty awesome. I'd imagine playing a Shield Agent interviewing Cosplayers as part of character creation to be similarly fun!
  • @jenskot We used your excellent cheat sheets on Wednesday to give the game a try. It was rather fun, though I haven't quite got my head around the resolution system, and interpersonal conflict abilities seemed thin on the ground. I suspect we'll try it again.
  • Cool!

    I'm glad they were helpful. We're currently revising them significantly to make the text much clearer. I'll keep everyone updated! It also looks like they may be translated in Italian and in French!

    If I had time I would create a 10+ page visual walk through to explain how to play with examples similar to an Ikea manual but with images from comic books to illustrate all the action.
  • Unfortunately I think I'm the only GM I know about in Tucson who would be really psyched to do a bunch of Marvel stuff. Alas!
  • Clearly, Jason, you need to "convince" a few people.

    John, those are all rad ideas. MWP can provide PDF prize support as we always do with events. Since you'll be at PAX East, I want to get you and Dave Chalker and me together over some kind of beverage to make plans for summer in a loose kind of awesome manner.

    Cheers
    Cam
  • edited March 2012
    I setup a repo for maintaining cheat sheets for the game. I've got an initial draft of the watcher sheet, although it needs to be cleaned up. It is basically the same as jenskot's with a section of advice from apocalypse world. I'll be putting a player sheet in there as well. I'll probably be creating other sheets as I find the need for them in play. The sheets are setup with LaTeX, so they'll be free of cost for anyone to fork the project and make their own sheets. Hopefully it proves to be a useful shared resource.

    MHR Cheat Sheets
  • Question: both John's and Jeffrey's sheets say that you can do thew following by spending a Doom Die:

    "Add an effect die to the doom pool"

    What does that mean? I'm not finding it in the OM. You spend a die from the Doom Pool to add a die to Doom Pool?
  • That may have been in an older cheat sheet (can't remember). But in the latest cheat sheet linked at the beginning of this thread, it effectively says:

    - You can add your Effect Die to the Doom Pool.

    You don't spend Doom Dice to do it. Just move your Effect Die from your Dice Pool right into the Doom Pool when your action succeeds!

    I'm having trouble finding the exact page this was on. Sometimes it's a bit difficult to find things in the book. Although I do really appreciate that the PDF comes with a hyperlinked index! That's pretty sweet. I need to add page numbers to the Cheat Sheets at some point so that it can act as both a Cheat Sheet and a hybrid Index!
  • Posted By: jenskotYou don't spend Doom Dice to do it. Just move your Effect Die from your Dice Pool right into the Doom Pool when your action succeeds!
    Found it! OM15: "The Watcher may add to the doom pool directly by spending effect dice from a villain’s action, rather than inflicting stress or creating a complication."

    Man, every time I re-read a section of this book, I notice a new rule. I miss the days of rule numbering, a la DragonQuest. :)
  • Yes! It took about 4-5 reads to find all these rules. My next cheat sheet update is to add page number references to everything. Thanks for finding that reference!
  • buzz, I believe you can also use take a trait die and add it to the doom pool by spending a watcher character's action for it in the same way you would take a support action with them
  • Posted By: jjafullerbuzz, I believe you can also use take a trait die and add it to the doom pool by spending a watcher character's action for it in the same way you would take a support action with them
    I am not sure that's the case. Watchers can make Recovery and Support actions without rolls.
  • Posted By: SkywalkerI am not sure that's the case. Watchers can make Recovery and Support actions without rolls.
    I'm pretty sure you are right regarding the rules as written. I'm so used to using the fate fractal that I probably, subconsciously invented a cortex fractal
  • Posted By: jjafullercortex fractal
    UNIVERSE IMPLODING
  • edited March 2012
    I admit rolling a Villain's gloating against the Doom Pool is a bit weird. Having them spend their action putting a Trait into Doom Pool makes sense.
  • edited March 2012
    Hey John, I have more feedback about your awesome cheat sheets. I have this feedback because I have been reading them over and over again as part of my prep! You rock.

    On the Hero Cheat Sheet and the Watcher Cheat Sheet, under USING EFFECT DICE, the second item reads:

    "Step up or down a trait (except trauma). If stress or complications exceeds D12, target can take actions till recovered."

    I assume this should read, "...target can take no actions till recovered"? (And, really, it's "until recovered"; a "till" is where you put money.)

    Under EARNING PLOT POINTS on both sheets, item four reads:

    "Watcher may reward you if you roleplay being stressed out."

    I couldn't find this in the rules. Any idea what page this is on?

    On the Watcher Cheat Sheet, under Growing the Doom Pool, the second item reads:

    "f the player rolls multiple opportunities, do the above multiple times or give the player 1 PP and step up a D4 for every opportunity rolled, and then add it to the doom pool."

    I believe this is incorrect. According to OM15, the die added to the Doom Pool always begins at D6.

    Lastly, just some general feedback about the Watcher Cheat Sheet:

    1. I think it would be even cooler if the Watcher sheet didn't repeat all of the player-centric material from the Hero sheet, e.g., spending and earning Plot Points, a villain data file sample instead of a hero sample, anything about XP other than how often the triggers can be hit, and so on. I like the idea of it being solely focused on what the Watcher needs to know in order to do their job. They can always have the Hero sheet handy.

    2. I love the page references! But, I think if you're referencing the same page, it's better to say "See Below" instead of "See p1", since the reader is already on page 1.
  • Thanks Mark! I've added all these to me To Do list!
    Posted By: buzz"Watcher may reward you if you roleplay being stressed out."

    I couldn't find this in the rules. Any idea what page this is on?
    OM59, LOSING CONTROL AND PLAYER AGENCY

    It's primarily about roleplaying being stressed out Mentally / Emotionally.
    Posted By: buzzOn theWatcher Cheat Sheet, under Growing the Doom Pool, the second item reads:

    "f the player rolls multiple opportunities, do the above multiple times or give the player 1 PP and step up a D4 for every opportunity rolled, and then add it to the doom pool."

    I believe this is incorrect. According to OM15, the die added to the Doom Pool always begins at D6.
    We're saying the same thing, just with different words.

    The default method is the first opportunity gives you a D6, the rest step up that D6.

    What I'm describing is take each opportunity (including the first one) and step up a D4. Same effect.

    Do you think I should use the original wording?
  • Also, any other feedback is very welcome!

    Next on my list is page reference numbers. Breaking out Opportunities into their own section for the Watcher. And Villain creation rules.
  • FWIW Cam confirmed that a Watcher can spend a D6 or higher from the doom pool to make an Asset or Complication persistent. Its not actually specified in the RAW.
  • Would it be fair to say that anything a Hero can do with a Plot Point, the Watcher can do with Doom Dice? What would the exception be?
  • Note that the correct terminology is step up, step back. Not step down.

    Cheers,
    Cam
  • edited March 2012
    Posted By: jenskotWould it be fair to say that anything a Hero can do with a Plot Point, the Watcher can do with Doom Dice? What would the exception be?
    I don't think that's the best approach as it likely to cause a whole bunch of small issues as the two sides are perfectly symmetrical.

    For example, I don't think the Watcher should be able to change Stress taken by a Watcher character unless, perhaps, they are a major character. It would be too easy to extend out combat and make even small fights a pain. This ties into the fact that Watcher characters recover in Transition as is needed by the story rather than the PCs process. If they could also spread around Stress then it would create a bias in their favour.
  • Cam, could we get a style guide to use for fan created materials?
  • Posted By: CamBanksNote that the correct terminology is step up, step back. Not step down.
    I'll add this to the list!
  • Posted By: jjafullerCam, could we get a style guide to use for fan created materials?
    I'm sure we can get one of those made. I'll ask our fabulous managing editor Amanda Valentine for one that's Heroic Roleplaying specific, not Marvel IP.

    Cheers,
    Cam
  • Posted By: jenskotOM59, LOSING CONTROL AND PLAYER AGENCY

    It's primarily about roleplaying being stressed out Mentally / Emotionally.
    Cool! Thanks.
    Posted By: jenskotWhat I'm describing is take each opportunity (including the first one) and step up a D4. Same effect.
    Sorry, I still don't understand. :( Where is this D4 coming from?

    My understanding is:

    1 Opportunity = pay the player 1 PP and add a D6 to the Doom Pool;

    2 Opportunities = pay the player 1 PP and add a D6 stepped up to D8 to the Doom Pool;

    OR

    2 Opportunities = pay the player 2 PP and add 2D6 to the Doom Pool.

    ...and so on. Isn't that right?
  • That's completely right.

    My D4 bit says the same thing but is poorly worded on my part. I shall revise or remove.
  • edited May 2012
    I've used these sheets, with thanks, but is there an updated version anywhere? Running MHR at Buckets of Dice (Christchurch con) at the weekend.
    (edited for "autocorrect")
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